Offers

Published by The National Herald, March 4, 2005

Archbishop of Athens Offers His Perspective

ATHENS – His Beatitude Archbishop Christodoulos of Athens’ exclusive interview with Alpha Channel’s senior news anchor, Nikos Hadjinikolaou, which aired last Friday, February 25, provided viewers with a unique opportunity to hear the Church of Greece’s presiding hierarch offer his own account of the people and events which have sent shockwaves throughout Greek society, and in recent days have even threatened to cost him his throne.

Resignation is not an option, the Archbishop told Mr. Hadjinikolaou. He is "not part of the problem," Christodoulos said, "rather the one who has been called upon to lead the Church out of this serious crisis and bring about the required catharsis."

The Archbishop’s answers provide a unique insight into his perspective of the unfolding events, and into the course of action that he intends to follow. Excerpts of some of the most salient points raised in the interview follow:

Nikos Hadjinikolaou: Your Eminence, in recent weeks, we’ve seen a series of scandals rock the Church of Greece, involving everything from foreign agents to embezzlement, and erotic escapades to gun-toting members of the clergy. What do you have to say about this sad state of affairs, and what kind of impact will it ultimately have on the standing of the Church?

Archbishop Christodoulos: The can be no doubt, Mr. Hadjinikolaou, that all these phenomena which you speak of exist, and are a source of tremendous grief and sorrow for all Christians. This is especially true for us, the clergy, as we have been entrusted with the spiritual guidance of the people, and we now find our institution at the center of these events. However, I would like to stress that the unacceptable behavior of certain corrupt individuals should not be construed as being typical of our Church. Thousands of people comprise the (ecclesiastical) body of our Church, from the Holy Synod’s 80 Hierarchs to the approximately 10,000 deacons, priests and archimandrites, married or celibate, as well as our other non-ordained employees, all of which are devoted to their duties and the provision of good services. All of these people give themselves to make the tremendous spiritual, social and philanthropic mission of the Church possible, and they are the ones who are truly representative of all that our Church stands for. Rest assured that these few individuals, who perjured themselves and have defamed the Church, are to be dealt with severely, as they have filled all of our hearts with sadness.

Hadjinikolaou: Do you feel personally responsible for the current situation that the Church of Greece finds itself in? Since you have already apologized to the faithful, you must feel a degree of responsibility.

Christodoulos: We have performed our self-criticism. This self-criticism has led us to the conclusion that, even though we are not personally responsible for any of these unacceptable activities, we feel the need to share the burden which is being shouldered by the Church due to the actions of members of the clergy who have disregarded their solemn vows.

Hadjinikolaou: Three Metropolitans have publicly voiced their opinion that you should resign. I’d like to ask you if this possibility has crossed your mind, since it’s obvious that you have no intention of doing so, and in fact, you have adopted a more "aggressive" stance against your attackers in recent days.

Christodoulos: Mr. Hadjinikolaou, I would like to assure you that every conceivable course of action has crossed my mind during this time, more thoughts than you could ever imagine. I’ve thought of every conceivable possibility, and weighed the pros and cons of several different options, and I quickly reached the conclusion that my resignation was not the answer. I rejected this option because I believe that I am not part of the problem, but rather the one who has been called upon to lead the Church out of this serious crisis and bring about the required catharsis.

Hadjinikolaou: But many people are saying that this catharsis of which you speak will apply to everyone except the Archbishop’s "inner circle." Let me be more specific, shouldn’t Metropolitan Theoklitos of Thessaliotida, who along with the Metropolitan Panteleimon of Attica, recommended that you appoint Archimandrite Giosakis to an important position in the Archbishopric, have been called upon to submit his resignation as soon as the revelations regarding the latter’s criminal activities were publicized?

Christodoulos: As you well know, Metropolitan Panteleimon has already been place on six month’s probation pending the outcome of our investigation into his activities, and Metropolitan Theoklitos has decided to submit his resignation to me, accepting full responsibility for his actions. I should note, however, that it was not only Metropolitans Panteleimon and Theoklitos who recommended Archimandrite Giosakis for a position in the Archbishopric, since several individuals outside the Church had also mentioned his name to me.

Hadjinikolaou: Would you care to tell us who else recommended Giosakis to you?

Hadjinikolaou: Archimandrite Giosakis was apparently very well connected with members of Greece’s judiciary. Were any of these individuals you mention judges or prominent lawyers?

Christodoulos: I don’t want to put anyone on the spot, as there is no reason for me to do so. What does matter is that several individuals recommended Giosakis to me, and that I ultimately declined to accept any of these recommendations.

Hadjinikolaou: It has been revealed that the Metropolitan of Piraeus had warned you in the past about Archimandrite Giosakis, saying that the people of Limnos had sent him packing; that the people of Kythira had sent him packing; and that his tenure in America had ended due to his involvement in financial scandals.

Christodoulos: This is true. The Metropolitan of Piraeus had, in fact, told me these things about Archimandrite Giosakis, but by the time we spoke about this matter, I had already rejected the recommendations to accept Archimandrite Giosakis in the Archbishopric, and I was well aware of the type of person that we were dealing with.

Hadjinikolaou: If this is indeed the case, how in the world could it be possible for Archimandrite Giosakis to subsequently arrange a meeting with high-ranking judges at the Archbishopric and, moreover, for him to participate in this meeting? Some people have said that, if your predecessor ever saw someone he didn’t like in the Archbishopric, he would tell him to take a hike.

Christodoulos: First of all, it is not clear whether Archimandrite Giosakis was involved in any way in this meeting I had with the judges at the Archbishopric. My secretary, who handles all such requests, typically arranges all of my meetings. When I meet with my office staff in the afternoon or evening, they usually just list everyone that requested a meeting, and almost never mention if any intermediaries were involved with each request. Now, as far as telling someone to "take a hike," like my late predecessor Archbishop Seraphim may well have done, I would have considered it uncouth to single out someone who accompanies invited guests into my office.

Hadjinikolaou: Would you care to tell us the names of some of the judges who participated in the meeting in question?

Christodoulos: I really don’t know. I can’t recall their names. What I do remember is that it was a group of judges that had recently been elected to their positions.

Hadjinikolaou: Among the many theories that have surfaced in recent days, some claim that Archimandrite Giosakis served as a go-between with Greece’s judiciary for court cases involving either the Church of Greece or you personally.

Hadjinikolaou: All these years, you haven’t been summoned to court even one time? Even as the plaintiff?

Christodoulos: Not during my reign as Archbishop. The only time I can remember being summoned to appear in court was in Volos, when I was still the Metropolitan of Demetriada.

Hadjinikolaou: Many people say that you are far too open with people and that, as a result, it has been possible for several "unsavory" characters to enter into your inner circle, and that you have provided your support to individuals such as Apostolos Vavilis who, as it turns out, are undeserving of your assistance.

Christodoulos: I think that it is quite naïve to claim that, whenever somebody provides a letter of recommendation, and its recipient subsequently behaves in an unacceptable manor or commits a crime, that the person who wrote the letter is somehow responsible for these actions. If this were the case, when an institution like the Academy of Athens presents an award, and the recipient of this award subsequently committed a crime, then the Academy would also be held responsible.

Hadjinikolaou: Could you please tell me about your acquaintance with Apostolos Vavilis, and how you ended up giving a letter of recommendation to a convicted drug dealer?

Christodoulos: First of all, I didn’t give a letter of recommendation to a convicted drug dealer, since the letter I wrote predates his arrest for drug trafficking. When I was serving as the Metropolitan of Demetriada in Volos, I had the opportunity to meet Mr. Vavilis’ parents, both of whom are teachers and very well respected members of the local community. At the time, I also became acquainted with Apostolos Vavilis, one of their two sons. Mr. Vavilis’ parents had requested a letter of recommendation from me at the time, since their son was finishing high school and planning to go to college abroad. Now this is the entire story up until the time I wrote the letter of recommendation. All the events that followed, namely how Mr. Vavilis ended up with the wrong crowd and was subsequently arrested for drug trafficking, were revealed to me at a much later date.

Hadjinikolaou: But you have since been in contact with Vavilis, even after his arrest and incarceration.

Christodoulos: Yes, that’s true. I did, in fact, meet with Mr. Vavilis while he was serving his prison sentence in Volos during the course of one of my scheduled visits to the penitentiaries, where I try and offer support to the inmates. I also recall that, upon his release from prison, he paid a visit to my office and sought to assure me that he was not guilty, and that he had, in fact, been cooperating with Greek drug enforcement authorities in efforts to uncover an illicit drug ring. It was obvious to me that Mr. Vavilis was one of those young men who view themselves as private detectives or investigators, always seeking to uncover one thing or the other.

Christodoulos: I do remember seeing him in Jerusalem at Patriarch Eirineos’ enthronement in 2001. I also recall seeing him in September of 2001, only a few days after the World Trade Center attacks.

Hadjinikolaou: It has been said, and there is photographic evidence to prove it, that during Patriarch Eirineos’ enthronement you were quite cordial with Vavilis when he came over to pay his respects, and that you commented that you were "quite glad that he had finally found his way."

Christodoulos: It is quite possible that I did, in fact, say these words. When one sees an individual, who has had serious problems with the law in the past, apparently offering his good services to the Patriarchate of Jerusalem, the first thought that comes to mind is that he has managed to overcome his problems and has changed his life completely.

Hadjinikolaou: Yes, but this does not negate the fact that Vavilis was wanted by Interpol at the time.

Hadjinikolaou: Didn’t the fact that Vavilis was using the alias, "Fokas," in Jerusalem make you the least bit suspicious? Didn’t you inquire why he had changed his name?

Christodoulos: I have always known him as Vavilis, and I didn’t feel compelled to ask his name, because I already knew who he was.

Hadjinikolaou: In the past, you have been accused of having "patriarchal" ambitions. Could all these characters be connected to your ambitions to exert control over Orthodox Patriarchates outside of Greece?

Christodoulos: I unequivocally reject these accusations. I have never had any such ambitions. As far as I am concerned, I have never made any statement to this effect that could justify such accusations. I deny these accusations, and I have oftentimes wondered which centers would want to associate my name with any such ambition. Have you ever heard me make any such statement?

Hadjinikolaou: Pardon me, Your Beatitude, but these things are typically done, and never said.

Hadjinikolaou: People are saying that you sent Vavilis and (retired police captain) Triantafylakis to Jerusalem in order to secure the throne for Patriarch Eirineos.

Christodoulos: Even if this were the case, what would it have to do with my ambitions to become a Patriarch? Where would I become a Patriarch? We have Eirineos in Jerusalem.

Hadjinikolaou: Then how did Patriarch Eirineos come into contact with Vavilis and Triantafylakis? He didn’t just find these two on the street outside the Patriarchate and invite them upstairs. Someone must have introduced them to Patriarch Eirineos, and what is being said is that one of your close associates made the introductions.

Christodoulos: No. As far as I know, none of my close associates did any such thing.

Hadjinikolaou: I’m sorry to have to phrase my next statement in this way, but if this is indeed the case, then either Patriarch Eirineos is lying, or you are, Your Beatitude.

Christodoulos: Agreed. I understand. I can only talk about myself, and all I can do is reiterate that we did not send Vavilis or Triantafylakis to Jerusalem.

Hadjinikolaou: How do you explain the change in Patriarch Eirineos’s position in recent days? Could a little bird from the Bosphorus have gone down to Jerusalem with a message, telling him to think things over, to see things from a different perspective?

Hadjinikolaou: I’m saying this because your relationship with Constantinople isn’t the greatest, and I don’t think that they are your biggest fans.

Christodoulos: Mr. Hadjinikolaou, we have the utmost respect for the Ecumenical Patriarchate.

Hadjinikolaou: Could it possibly be behind all this, or at least be providing support to the people who are?

Christodoulos: I cannot even fathom this supposition. All I know is that we think very fondly of the Ecumenical Patriarchate. The Patriarchate in Constantinople is our parent Church; we recognize its position as first among equals; we recognize the fact that it is "guarding the straits of Thermopylae"; we recognize all this. If we had our differences in the past, this does not affect our feelings overall. We happened to see some things differently and tried to convince the Patriarchate that we were right.

All we have done is to try and secure the independence of our Church, in accordance with the relevant holy canons and patriarchal acts. Whoever tries to give any other meaning to our efforts is mistaken.

Our sincere feelings of respect and honor towards the Ecumenical Patriarchate should never be put in question.

Hadjinikolaou: Tell me, Your Beatitude, do you believe there is an international plot behind all these attacks that have been directed against you? We have heard numerous politicians and certain Metropolitans asking you to resign. We have also heard that foreign intelligence agencies like Israel’s Mosad, Turkey’s MIT, and even the CIA, are unhappy with the positions you have adopted on various issues and, as such, have decided to remove you from your position. Do you lend credibility to any of these possibilities?

Christodoulos: My answer to you is that, since none of them are secrets and have been on the front pages of almost every newspaper in recent days, the Greek people are smart enough to evaluate all these things that you mentioned. I don’t want to go into any further details on this matter.

Christodoulos: This is certain. But in order to avoid saying things that aren’t true and make unfounded accusations, the root of the problems we are facing require further analysis.

Hadjinikolaou: Although I understand that this is a highly improper question Your Beatitude, could you please tell me if you own any real estate?

Christodoulos: Since you pose this question, I will answer it. I do not have any property, real estate or otherwise, in my possession. Whoever is inclined to do so can check Greece’s local land registries and confirm the fact that no property is owned by Archbishop Christodoulos Paraskevaides.

Hadjinikolaou: Another question that has been on many peoples’ minds in recent days is whether the recent spate of sexual scandals involving members of the clergy could be at least partially addressed by a return to the status quo that existed during the first centuries of our Church’s existence, when high-ranking clerics were allowed to marry.

Christodoulos: I have also heard this, and I have examined the matter very closely. One of the main problems in abolishing the aforementioned restriction on our Bishops is the fact that an Ecumenical Council imposed it, centuries before the schism of the Church. Therefore, a new Ecumenical Council would be required to reverse this decision, and under the current ecclesiastical circumstances, this would be almost impossible to do. As you see, this is a matter that far exceeds the jurisdiction of the Church of Greece.



Volume 7 Number 10 - Tuesday, March 8th, 2005	A Publication of the ORTHODOX CHRISTIAN LAITY