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Published by the
Chiesa Newsletter,
November 4, 2004
From Athens
to Rome: The Scuttled Voyage
of His Beatitude
Christodoulos |
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The
holy synod of the Greek Orthodox Church shelves
the archbishop of Athens' visit to the pope. The
archbishop speaks his mind in an interview. An
ecumenism with Catholics "in economy class"
by
Sandro Magister
ROMA – On Saturday, November 27, John Paul II will
restore to the ecumenical patriarch of
Constantinople, Bartholomew I, the relics of St.
John Chrysostom and St. Gregory Nazianzen, which
were smuggled away by the crusaders after the sack
of the capital of the empire in the East, in 1204.
Bartholomew I asked to have the relics back while
meeting with the pope in Rome last June. And John
Paul II promptly agreed.
The pope had once been planning to go in person to
Constantinople on November 30, the feast of St.
Andrew, and also to visit the capital of Turkey,
Ankara. But the trip was cancelled, and it will be
Bartholomew I who will come to Rome to receive the
relics at a solemn ceremony in St. Peter's
basilica.
Moreover, John Paul II was preparing to receive in
Rome, toward the end of 2004, a visit from another
lofty exponent of Orthodoxy, the Greek primate
Christodoulos, archbishop of Athens.
The pope was to have given him another venerated
relic, one of the links from the chain of St.
Paul's imprisonment, which had been promised to
the archbishop during the pope's visit to Greece
in May of 2001.
But this visit to Rome by an Orthodox archbishop
of Athens – the first in history – was suddenly
cancelled at the beginning of October.
It was scuttled by the holy synod of the Greek
Orthodox Church, which in a vote of 45-15 required
that Christodoulos delay the trip.
For what reason? Because of an insurmountable
hostility toward the Church of Rome? The same
hostility that had constrained John Paul II to
wait 23 years before visiting Athens?
Archbishop Christodoulos granted us the following
interview in Athens:
"We Are All in the Same Boat"
An interview with His Beatitude Christodoulos,
archbishop of Athens and all Greece
Q: Who blocked your trip to Rome, and why?
A: "The conservative elements of our Church have
not forgotten the wounds we have received from the
Catholics throughout history. We have freedom of
the press, and the fundamentalist circles write,
and encourage others to write, that we should not
have relations with the Church of Rome. This is
not my opinion. We must sensitize our bishops and
people and help them to understand that, without
denying history, we can initiate a new era of
mutual understanding and collaboration."
Q: Do you have contacts with the tiny Greek
Catholic Church?
A: "I have excellent relations with the Greek
Catholic community. Some of its bishops were my
classmates, at the Catholic school run by the
French Marianists. We have taken concrete steps
together, for example making possible the pope's
visit inb 2001, which met with very strong
opposition among us but then came off to
everyone's satisfaction. We collaborate on issues
of bioethics, on social questions, in the
advancement of women. One other meeting place with
Catholics was that provided by the attempt to
introduce a reference to Christianity as the
foundation of the continent's unity into the
preamble of the European constitution.
Unfortunately, as is well known, this mention was
denied, almost as if in denial of the very
monuments of the spirit and of art that cry aloud
the truth of the matter."
Q: These are the points of agreement. What about
those of disagreement?
A: "Two years ago, I invited the Greek Catholic
bishops to my office. We agreed to meet again, but
that was unfortunately not possible, because the
Catholic community saddened us a bit by not
supporting our Church's effort to prevent
religious affiliation from being eliminated from
identity cards. Kostas Simitis' socialist
government announced this decision suddenly, while
I was in Romania, and we reacted by collecting
three million signatures and calling for mass
demonstrations. But the Greek Catholic Church
opposed our effort: they think that the mention of
religion on the identity card provokes
discrimination against those who are not Orthodox
Christians. This is not true. I told a Catholic
archbishop: 'If we do not react immediately to
this action against the Church, others will
follow. We're all in the same boat, and when we
sink we'll all sink, regardless of whether we
travel in business or economy class'."
Q: How do you think the Church should react to the
secularist offensive?
A: We Christians should agree on how to react
toward secularism, but we don't do this enough.
The Protestants, for example, have done nothing on
behalf of the mention of Christian roots in the
charter of Europe. We should be more vigilant.
Secularism draws many away from the Church, but
the Church should be close to the people, to help
them. There are discussions about how to overcome
the lack of trust among people within the Church.
The Church should not follow the world in order to
win it over, but should stand before the people
and show them the way of salvation. The Orthodox
Church is a Church of tradition. In our life, the
worship of God takes first place. We keep alive
our ascetic practices, fasting, all-night prayer
vigils, and our monasteries are centers of
spiritual life. We know that we have changed
nothing of what was established by the apostles
and the holy fathers. Modernism is outside the
garden of the Church. Especially in matters of
faith, change is not possible at all."
Q: Are you sure the people will follow you?
A: "Both in Greece and in the Greek diaspora
throughout the world, we construct two things
first of all in each new city: the church and the
school, or the places for priest and teacher,
faith and education. In any case, for more than
four hundred years we have been under a dominion
of different nation and religion. And who has
remained close to the ordinary people, while our
intellectuals emigrated to the West? The priest
and the bishop. They are the ones who have brought
comfort to the people. They have preserved the
people's language and identity. They have guided
them to independence. They have helped them to
rise up, not through imposition, but because the
people wanted it. Perhaps Western Europe cannot
understand this, because to it the priest seems
far removed socially and ideologically. We in
Greece, as a Church, are the continuation of the
ancient assembly of the people, when in democratic
Athens all of the citizens participated in the
governing of the city. The same is happening in
our time: all in the parish participate without
distinction, in their own roles, and I have never
heard a better interpretation of the relationship
between Church and state, between the Church and
the people in Greece, than that given by a Turkish
scholar who during a convention in Cyprus said
that he was jealous of how the Church in Greece
has helped in the liberation and development of
the country, while in his Muslim country religion
has led to deterioration instead."
Q: But the Greek Church has the reputation of
being conservative and backward.
A: "I remember what a French journalist wrote
recently in the newspaper 'La Croix'. He
understood the identification of the priest with
the people in Greece when he saw our married
priests live with their children and wives like
other men, when he saw them have coffee with their
faithful after the mass, when he realized that
there is great comprehension and affection for the
people on the part of the Church, as in
matrimonial questions, in which two divorces and
three marriages are permitted. If one learns only
from written texts, and not from real life, what
the relations are between Church and state in
Greece, then one might judge us as being
conservative or backward. But this is inaccurate.
On questions of human rights and religious liberty
we are pioneers for the whole world, not only in
law but also in the people's mentality."
Q: Pioneers of civilization?
A: "Bad information about us set up the whole
world for the big surprise of the Olympic games in
Athens, when this Greek people succeeded in doing
what seemed unattainable: organizing the games
better than many countries considered developed,
and moreover with the culture from which these
games were born. There is a confusion in the West
about the terms 'civilization' and 'culture'.
There are civilized peoples that lack culture,
like 'paideia' and the sense of life. Civilization
for us does not mean only means of transportation,
roads, public works. Civilization is the road one
takes in life, the care of one's fellow man, love
for one's suffering neighbor. Very often
development comes at the price of solitude,
desperation, boredom with life, a lack of optimism
and hope, recourse to medication as a false escape
from life's labyrinthine ways. We must learn the
humility of moderation: 'métron áriston',
moderation is best, as our ancestors said. We must
learn to temper technology with culture in order
to bring our civilization to life."
Q: What do you think of the possible entry of
Turkey into the European Union?
A: "The ecumenical patriarch of Constantinople,
Bartholomew I, tends to favor the entry of Turkey
into the European Union, and we agree with him.
But there are a few priorities: human rights and
religious freedom. Furthermore, is Turkey ready to
share the principles of European civilization? And
then, from the geographical point of view, where
does Europe end? At Constantinople, certainly, but
how far does the area of Constantinople extend?
European identity is also determined by race and
religion: on this point, we have not yet arrived
at a conclusion."
Q: What is your judgment on ecumenism?
A: “We look favorably on the ecumenical movement
and hope that theological dialogue between
Catholics and Orthodox will resume as soon as
possible."
Q: What, in your assessment, are the greatest
obstacles?
A: “The problem of uniatism [Eastern rite Churches
in union with the pope of Rome] is particularly
serious for many national Orthodox Churches, and
we hope it can be overcome as soon as possible. We
will also need to discuss the ministry of Peter
from a theological point of view."
Q: John Paul II brought up this point himself in
the encyclical "Ut Unum Sint."
A: “For us Orthodox, the bishop of Rome has a
primacy of honor, and not of jurisdiction. This is
a difficult question and it requires much
patience, attention, and prayer, given that
serious ecclesiological differences have arisen
between Orthodox and Catholics over many
centuries, which will not be easy to erase. The
responsibility belongs to all of us, bishops,
clerics, and laymen, and depends upon our own
initiative, so we must ask with great humility for
the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ and his
illumination, saying 'Speak, O Lord, your servant
is listening.' The fact is that the struggle for
the imposition of earthly power [of one Church
over others] is inconvenient, and spiritual unity
is more effective, according to the words of the
apostle Paul, the founder of the Church of
Greece."
Q: There has long been talk of a synod for all of
the Orthodox Churches. At what stage are the
preparations?
A: "It is to the ecumenical patriarch of
Constantinople – the first according to an ancient
hierarchy of honor – that the role belongs of
coordinating the gathering of a pan-Orthodox
synod, which has not happened for more than a
thousand years. We hope, pray, and (speaking for
ourselves) seek to eliminate the obstacles in
order to reach the blessed moment of our plenary
reunion in the Holy Spirit."
Q: How are your relations with the patriarchate of
Constantinople?
A: “After a serious clash [over the nomination of
three bishops in northern Greece], I would say
that mutual affection and understanding are
returning. The primary thing is the pastoral care
of the people, whose servants we are. We should
not sadden or scandalize them over questions
which, moreover, they do not understand."
Q: And relations with the Orthodox Churches of
Russia and Romania? They accuse the Greeks of
controlling the patriarchates of Alexandria in
Egypt and Jerusalem.
A: "The truth is that the historic patriarchates
of Alexandria in Egypt and Jerusalem have very few
faithful, and it is the Greek Church that helps
them, lending them three hundred of its priests,
many of whom are missionaries in Africa. The
Orthodox mission in Kenya, Uganda, and other
African countries traditionally is led by the
patriarchate of Alexandria in Egypt. And the new
patriarch nominated just recently, Feofan, from
the island of Crete, is giving a strong impulse to
the mission."
__________
Also present at the interview with the archbishop
of Athens was bishop Athanasios of Achaia,
representative of Greek Church in Brussels.
Athanasios is the one who responded to the last
question, and to the preceding one on the entry of
Turkey into Europe.
__________
But for Catholic Archbishop Fóscolos, the
Barricades Have not Fallen
In the newspaper of the Italian bishops'
conference, "Avvenire," correspondent Mimmo Muolo
on October 29 compared some affirmations from
Archbishop Christodoulos on relations with the
Catholics of Greece with other affirmations – of a
different tenor – from the Catholic archbishop of
Athens, Nikolaus Fóscolos.
In Greece, there are 50,000 Hellenic Catholics, .5
percent of the population, but 2-300,000 Catholic
immigrants of various nationalities have joined
them in the last few years.
Fóscolos complains that they are treated like
second class citizens: "Here, the non-Orthodox are
not considered real Greeks."
And he maintains that the inclusion of religious
affiliation on identity cards "was a factor of
discrimination: our young people, on account of
this label, frequently were unable to find work."
For this reason, the Catholic community favored
the abolition of its inclusion, while the Orthodox
Church protested vigorously against the move.
The lack of recognition of the Catholic Church's
legal public personality is another cause for
dissatisfaction for Fóscolos:
"Since 1946, Greek law has prevented our
organizations created after that date from being
recognized by the state. It is time to put an end
to this injustice. It is, in fact, evident that
the government does not want to make the Orthodox
Church unhappy for a religious minority like ours.
We hope that things will change thanks to the
European Union."
Another case of friction between the Greek
Orthodox Church and the Catholics is very recent.
Fóscolos says:
“On October 15, I personally heard archbishop
Christodoulos affirm, in the course of a
television newscast, that 'the Christians of the
West have falsified Christianity.' This is how our
bishops' conference responded in a statement the
following day: 'How can we bring our two Churches
closer together when we hear Archbishop
Christodoulos use offensive words in regard to the
Catholic Church?' I know that the press office of
the Orthodox Church then issued a correction, but
declarations like these risk refocusing the
fundamentalism of the most intransigent of the
Orthodox."
Christodoulos uttered the contested phrase in the
city of Kastoria, in the homily for the
celebration of the Greek war against the Turks and
Bulgarians at the beginning of the twentieth
century. The Greek Catholic Bishops, gathered for
an episcopal conference, interpreted it as an
attack against the Catholic Church, just as the
state television news program did in reporting it.
In the correction, the Orthodox archdiocese of
Athens denied having wanted to attack the Catholic
Church, and explained that the phrase in its
entirety should have been interpreted as a call to
humility issued to all Christians, beginning with
the Greek Orthodox Church itself.
'Protosinkellos' Thomas, vicar general for
Archbishop Christodoulos, made an analogous
correction in a conversation with the Vatican
nuncio in Greece, Paul Fouad Tabet.
Hostility against the Church of Rome and against
ecumenical dialogue are a constant in the Greek
Church, much more so than in other Orthodox
Churches. In 1963, Christodoulos' predecessor,
Chrisostomos II, entreated the patriarch of
Constantinople, Athenagoras, not to meet Pope Paul
VI in Jerusalem – as indeed took place – because
it would be like "planting a murderous knife in
the heart of the Orthodox Church."
The monasteries of Mount Athos are also
historically a bulwark of resistance to ecumenism,
apart from a few recent exceptions.
Catholic archbishop Fóscolos says: "The pope's
visit in 2001 overthrew the wall, but some
barricades still remain."
The holy synod's cancellation of the planned
voyage of Christodoulos to Rome is proof of this.
Also waiting in Rome for the Orthodox archbishop
of Athens was a degree 'honoris causa' in canon
law from the Pontifical Lateran University. It
remains in the drawer.
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